From Merciful via the feedback form
Thank-you for your helpful resource, wisdom and willingness to help others! Background: 32 yr happy marriage now in MLC for 4.5 yrs. First 2 yrs spouse lived at home; last 2.5 yrs spouse lives 100 miles away. Won’t divorce, but dangles it as an option. Affair(s); appears to be with same OW long term though not living with her. Non-communicative, secrecy, dishonesty, totally different person. Supportive to me financially, desires to be “best friends”, wants to visit regularly for activities, events, recreation and known comfort zone with me. I am not sexually intimate with him under these conditions. After a few days he retreats back to secret life. No end in sight to all of this childishness. While I have been caring, kind, supportive and thoughtful through this nonsense, my emotional attachment is waning under the circumstances. The love is there. I need to grow, progress and find joy outside of this situation and don’t find the present dynamics to be beneficial for either of us. How helpful is disengaging, no further visits or time spent together, and limited communication from this point forward until he comes to some clarity as he “finds himself”. I’m all for helping the man I love through a tough time in his life, but this lifestyle is simply not contributing to the progress of either one of us! Your helpful insight as to how to tread lightly yet distance from the chaos is very appreciated.
Dear Merciful,
I’m very glad that you find my website helpful to you. 🙂 First of all, there is nothing you can “do” to help him. He must learn to help himself-he’s the only one who can. It doesn’t surprise me this man is dangling divorce as an option. I suspect that he’s using it to try and emotionally blackmail you every time you don’t do what he wants you to do. My advice is to call him on it, and keep the decision for filing on his shoulders. What he’s trying to do is control his circumstances, environment, and the situation as a whole. Apparently, he thinks divorce is something that you are afraid of. Is it? Mid-life spouses will often threaten the left-behind spouses, as a controlling aspect, with what they’re most afraid of, whether it be leaving,(actually abandonment), or divorce.
There are many people who are afraid of both, so because of fear, they’ll cave to the demands, when they really shouldn’t cave at all. Considering that fact that one has no control over what the mid-life spouse does or doesn’t do, those kinds of bluffs should always be called without negotiation, and without showing any emotional upset. In this area, a firm boundary should always be set, making sure to put that kind of decision BACK on the shoulders of the threatening party. If a person gets upset, and doesn’t learn to simply draw the emotional line, the mid-life spouse’s threats, and emotional terrorism in these areas will escalate. So, don’t engage him, when he dangles this option in front of you, firmly, and matter of factly tell him if he wants a divorce he would be the one to file, but stop threatening you with it. When you do this, be firm, but matter of fact.
While I always advise being friendly but distant, I don’t suggest agreeing to be “best friends” with your mid-life spouse. With friends like him, you sure don’t need any enemies, and mid-life spouses are the worst for wanting to be “friends” while they’re otherwise engaged in an affair-if you agree to be his friend, it would mean (in his mind), that you were condoning his affair, when you really don’t.
He’s apparently cycling back and forth between you and the other woman, as he is trying to figure out what he wants-but I suspect that this kind of cycling must be settling into some kind of predictive pattern that you’re able to see clearly. Since he finds no real change in your behavior toward him, (you’re being loving, thoughtful, etc, but at a high emotional cost to yourself), each time he cycles back, he gets restless and leaves again, retreating back into his former behaviors.
You’re treating him well, but also, treating him in such a way that he keeps thinking that what he’s doing is OK, when it’s not. Not your fault, you come across as a pretty patient lady, but patience is one thing, his trying to keep you dangling while he makes up his mind is quite another.
We can set loving boundaries without getting mean or nasty on our part-yet, any person who is the subject of boundaries that hasn’t learned to accept limits in their lives will protest very loudly, get nasty, and angry, because they don’t want to grow up.
There is always the chance, either way, that he could decide to just walk away-but that’s the chance you take when you choose to reclaim your self-respect through setting behavioral boundaries.
You need to grow, like you say, but it’s not HIM that’s holding you back, it’s YOU that’s holding you back. He can’t do anything to you that you don’t allow him to do.
So, something different must needs to be done, and I would suggest you first begin removing the comfort zone you’re saying that he finds with you, and back off enough to see what happens. He may bluster, threaten, get angry, say you don’t care, amongst other things, but it’s apparent the situation is cycling, and not in a good way. He could do this forever, but I’m aware that you don’t want to, and I don’t blame you.
You don’t have to mean to him, just be firm with him, set your boundary on time spent with you. Tell him that you cannot be his friend, see him, associate with him, while he’s seeing another woman-this is NOT a boundary, this would be you bowing out of the situation, giving him a choice to make. This would force the other woman into the position of meeting the needs you’re currently meeting. It seems to me like he’s letting her meet some needs while you’re meeting others, and he could go on for quite some time, and he will do it for as long as you let him.
The thing is, she doesn’t know him like you do, and so, we would hope the other woman would be set up for a major fail in this area. It seems to me that he’s also trying to have both worlds without having to choose one of them. Now, you know you can’t set a direct boundary on his affair, because that will backfire on you, depending how deep his current infatuation for the other woman is. You don’t have control over whom he sees, associates with, and if you try controlling that part of his life, he will only see the OW as being more attractive, so don’t set any boundaries there.
My thoughts are that I don’t think he wants to lose you-I really think he needs some boundaries set. You might want to go read up on them, and then sit down and figure out exactly how you would want to go about setting these. He’s most likely going to get angry either way you go, but again, in my humble opinion, if you don’t make a stand for your self-respect, he might decide to walk away completely anyway, but that’s a chance you’ll need to take, either way this goes.
When you set a boundary, you’re giving someone a choice to either honor the boundary, or not honor it. This could go either way, so be prepared before you make this choice. However, before you become afraid, bear in mind, that he’s already lost to you, and you’ve nothing further to lose by choosing to take this action to see if things will turn around within this area. I know one thing, it’s apparent that what you’ve been doing hasn’t worked, and/or the cycling he’s done has gotten worse, hence your reaching out to me for advice.
I hope this helps.
BIG HUGS!!
HB
Thank you kindly for your thoughtful and considerate response. You have such valuable insight and
awareness into what we, as fellow sojourners in this wilderness, have yet to learn along the way! I have
taken your counsel to heart and am beginning to understand it is not about “throwing him a life raft”
so he can get safely back to shore with my help. It’s more like he willfully chose to jump overboard
and needs to experience the painstaking effort of navigating on his own to the destination of his choice.
What I don’t understand is what internal conflict makes him lack confidence in his own ability to stake
a claim in his marriage after all this, recognize the futility of the whole experience, and begin to find
peace within himself and our relationship? Perhaps I expect more than he is emotionally capable of?
This experience in life has to be the most perplexing, challenging and testing of any other! At least
I value the import for the opportunity to discover personal growth and development like I never
imagined! Thank-you again for your blessings to all!
Merciful,
I can understand the confusion, as the crisis is confusing enough, without all the aspects that surround it. 🙂
The “internal conflict” you (and most other people) are having so much trouble understanding is also known as “past issues” that can stretch all the way to childhood. When people continually bury these unresolved past issues deep within their psyche, refusing to face, resolve and heal these, like an untreated wound, they have a tendency to infect, fester, and swell, eventually coming to a head. When this “head” pops, and the infection begins to overflow, (for lack of better description), the person in question is overrun, overwhelmed, and internal conflict gets worse. Things will always get worse, before they get better, reach resolution, or the person in question can become stuck, continue to run. What they do, really isn’t up to us, because it’s their problem, their mid-life crisis, and all we can do is standby, hold onto hope, God, and pray for them, while we let them go to figure it all out on their own. I think, (but I’m not sure), that I have an article up here that speaks of people in the mid-life crisis whose past becomes suspect and/or subject to question.
They will question everything about their lives-this is the same journey they navigated during Puberty, and didn’t finish this during that first time, so they’re going back through again in an effort to finish what they started as teenagers…of course, the differences are they’re older, they have the more mature mental capability(which they either don’t use, or use very little of) that helps them somewhat.
However, just like puberty, logical thinking goes out the window, and emotional thinking takes over-and so that’s why their decisions are made based on feelings, rather than logic.
Quite a few people come into their 30’s still lacking emotional maturity-it’s like they are “stuck” in “teenagerish” type ways of speaking, dealing, and this even extends into their relationships. When the mid-life crisis hits, all these things increase exponentially, and what they’ve used defense mechanisms to avoid for all that time, comes back with a vengeance. And it takes time to sort oneself out, and figure out what will be best for themselves…and though people can influence each other, no one can live their lives for them–and so, we learn to step back from what we don’t understand, and learn to give them space, time, and while they are on their journey, we learn to take ours-which isn’t any different than theirs, except for the timing of the same.
I hope further helps.
((hugs))
Thank you again for your considerate, compassionate, very insightful replies and information. MLC spouse
now claims no further interest, contact, desire or pursuit of OW in response to my firm choice to discontinue
contact with him until he resolves his own conflict and confusion. MLC spouse continues to visit me regularly for several days, enjoying the stable, hospitable, family-oriented, busy life I now lead. However,
due to mistrust based on prior moral and punitive behaviors following Bomb Drop and while in Replay ,
I honestly don’t trust a word he says because he’s like a child trying to pacify his parent while acting like
a rebellious teen. For all I know, he may be actively continuing an affair or even trolling for a new partner,
all the while using me, our family, and home as an emotional buffer during his transition period to a more stable self. I feel like a Mother counseling his indiscretions, teaching virtue, standing for what is
right and holding him to a standard above his present shortcomings. In response, he will often discredit
morality, smite virtue, attempt to discredit good motives and acts, and maintain his convoluted sense of
reality. Keep in mind, prior to MLC these contrasts were not there, as he was an upstanding leader with
what I thought was strong character. Among other comments from you on these thoughts, may I ask
whether men in MLC were ever emotionally mature individuals in our long term marriages? Or, were
they limping along using the “mask”, “performance”, “busyness”, “stuffing”, etc. to maintain appearances and also to keep from experiencing intimate, vulnerable, growth-oriented communication in marriage?
When my MLC spouse tells me his distance, separation and life away offer him control over his circumstances without expectations from me, yet frequently seeks my time and stability for his benefit
and control of his very unstable circumstances, I am unsure how my involvement can be of any benefit
to his growth and progress. There’s only so much a loving, caring, supportive wife can do before the
dysfunction and futility of the whole relationship in this state is clear. Status-quo isn’t the answer due
to his leverage of important financial and related matters. For all I know, he may be using present
circumstances to favor an intended outcome that does not bless me or that of our family. Thank you
so much for your encouragement and inspiration – the Lord does give us faith and hope toward an
expected end!
Dear Merciful,
I think I’d tell that man to put his money where his mouth is…to prove to you that she’s really gone, because I’m with you, I don’t think so, either.
If the other woman is truly out of the picture, you would know in a short time, because the signs of the Affair Processing, also known as OW Withdrawal will begin to become evident within your mid-life spouse, once all contact with the affair partner is stopped. If he doesn’t begin what you would recognize as an emotional grieving process for a lost connection, you’ll know the affair is still going on, and I believe your Intuition will instruct you to take stronger measures, Merciful. However, I believe that before he goes on to break this down fully, he is looking for an “open door” that would lead back to you at a later time.
I cannot explain to people exactly how this is shown, except to counsel them in patience, love and understanding. You can show him this “open door” without compromising your own boundaries in regards to discontinuing contact with him until he gets rid of her. Mid-life spouses are so selfish, and self-serving–they think to make sure they don’t end up alone. What they don’t realize is if they keep playing a situation, they stand to lose all the way around, and sometimes loss like that is necessary to really get their attention.
The fact is, you KNOW HIM, and you know what would work on him—in spite of the crisis that is currently overlaid across his personality, the man you know is still in there, albeit buried deeply under his behaviors, and various antics that you are clearly tired of–and I also understand that, too.
I validate and understand your observation, because you should NOT trust anything he says–however, God is not mocked, and your Intuition is stronger than you realize-very strong, as a matter of fact. You know whether he’s lying to you or not…and if your gut says he is, most likely, he IS lying.
Even though you may feel like a “Mother” to him, don’t become his mother. You didn’t raise him, nor break him, so you’re not expected to take on his “second raising” nor called upon to “fix” him in any way.
Also, I sense that you’re a strong lady, coping well in spite of circumstances, and you’re looking for some validation, a sounding board, and of course, a little guidance mixed in to help you understand and know if you’re doing all right at this point. You’re doing well, better than you think. I cannot tell you exactly what to do-the choices are yours. It’s apparent that he’s going back and forth, because he wants to know you’re still there for him, but he doesn’t want things to change, and your dealings with him must change in some way, to further get his attention.
This would not be so you could “control” him–any boundary you decide to set on his access to the home, would be up to him to honor or not, as the said boundary would be to protect you, not him. Setting firm and clear limits aren’t designed as punishment, although the mid-life spouse who encounters these will often cry foul and their confusion would increase as their rebellion would also increase.
If you think it’s best to tell him not to come around for awhile, be prepared for him to do just the opposite-increase his visits, rather than abide by your wishes. You are currently meeting needs that his affair partner can’t even hope to meet in him-and it’s apparent he’s trying to have both of you at his disposal.
So, how would you think to remove yourself from the equation at this point in such a way that lets him know enough is enough? You’re the only one who can answer that for yourself. Whatever you do, pray on it, and about it, before you begin taking further steps in this matter. IMHO, I think he needs to see and understand that you’re emotionally “leaving” him behind, and some people have to see/sense the emotional door “closing” before they’ll finally choose to scurry inside. I could be wrong, but I really don’t think he wants to lose you, hence his claims when you said you would discontinue contact with him–and then, he proceeded to cross the boundary you set, right?
Let me know what happens as you continue moving into new territory with this.
What you describe in response to all your counseling efforts, is quite common within the crisis–as they do become the opposite of what you knew them to be prior to them going into the depths of the mid-life crisis. What they once loved they hate, and what they once hated, they love—and it’s all part of their quest to find balance within the latter half of their lives. What he spouts now, won’t be what he says later, and many things must be “outgrown” as he continues his growth going forward.
I’m not saying it’s right-I’m just saying that’s how it is. He has to figure out what’s right for himself-and I would suggest considering the further increasing of the space you’ve been giving him, as it’s obvious he’s pursuing to try and keep the status quo in place. Try letting him know that when he figures out what he wants, to let you know, but until he does, you don’t want to hear from him, and see what his response is. It’s a tricky tightrope, as it’s obvious you still love him, but at the same time, you’re very irritated at his various childish behaviors.
Among other comments from you on these thoughts, may I ask whether men in MLC were ever emotionally mature individuals in our long term marriages?
Or, were they limping along using the “mask”, “performance”, “busyness”, “stuffing”, etc. to maintain appearances and also to keep from experiencing intimate, vulnerable, growth-oriented communication in marriage?
The answer to your first question is not really. During any length of a marriage, it takes two people to help each other grow in many ways. Each person doesn’t just bring the “Samsonite luggage” of their past issues into a marriage, they also bring various strengths, which help to counterbalance the other person’s weaknesses. Sometimes, both people do manage to grow up and become what they should be before the transition comes forth. If a person were all they should have already become before the mid-life transition came about, they wouldn’t be dealing in this way now.
To risk becoming a philosopher on this subject, God would have us to fully mature in emotional, mental and physical aspects, while continuing our spiritual growth. Anything less than that shows a true imbalance that the crisis seeks to bring into balance. A lot, but not all of the men, act like over-grown boys during their marriage(s). Some don’t grow up until the mid-life process overtakes them, while others fight the process of change, growth, and becoming, because their emotional growth was so seriously stunted, it was unreal. I’ve known men who’ve thrown tantrums their whole lives, when they didn’t get what they wanted, and these tantrums got worse during the crisis–to the point of violence. Some of these, after making horrible mistakes, came through the whole of the process, and settled down, and gentled in amazing ways, while others chose to continue running away.
I’ve seen what seemed to be the most responsible of men, go completely crazy, and do things I never would have thought they’d do, but they did, and they lived to regret it.
However, for some men, many minor changes are made, but then, the major changes are often fought when the transition comes forth. They find they’re facing more than they think they can take-the emotional pain that sweeps over them becomes such they choose to run, rather than do this necessary facing, and it’s years before they finally connect the pain within with the answers they were searching for all that time–then, they’ll do the inner work.
I’ve even known men who were in their advanced years before they finally chose to grow up-I cannot say if it was because they finally realized that it was in them to do this, because if they didn’t, they would end up all alone before life’s end, or if the emotional pain they continued to experience finally increased to the point they were forced to finally do what they should have done all along–I would suspect it might be the latter, because any human being will procrastinate what needs to be done until the pain within their psyche increases to the point they really are forced to complete the emotional growth that truly started within them so long ago.
Not all of the men were as you’re describing in your question, Merciful, I believe it depends on how willing the couple is as a whole to learn new things, learn new ways of relating, learn how to grow together, and in this process, learn how to love in ways they weren’t taught when they were children. Although neither person can grow in place of the other, if one person learns aspects of change, growth, and becoming-they can become most able to trigger the other, or even risk seeing them walk away, because in the end, people still have choices to exercise.
My son once said that a man who chooses his path, will live his path-and this is something I’ve never forgotten.
The answer to your second question is each person is different in how they choose to deal with various circumstances that life is certainly going to throw at them. I can’t speak for all of them, but I think it all goes back to people doing the best they can with what they know, and have learned during their earlier lives before the transitional period came along. The crisis teaches a harsh lesson that is often learned through the various mistakes the mid-life spouse will often make. They’ll lose something during that time, but at the same time, they’ll gain something better–IF they will simply buckle down and allow the crisis to work its process out within them.
It’s not a good thing to all of a sudden discover that life is not all you thought it was cracked up to be, and people don’t just wake up one day and decide to wreak havoc on their marriages. We were created for a purpose, and for a while, the mid-life spouse loses complete sight of this, or it’s always possible they never knew this in the first place. It’s not until much later they hopefully realize that they are truly here for a definitive purpose, and begin getting themselves in line with whatever purpose they’re to accomplish.
People have told me before they don’t know why they’re here, and once upon a time, I didn’t know why I was here, either. However, I carried away from my own Transitional period a very real sense of purpose in my life-and I could see it in my past, because what I endured within this past has been carried forward many times over to help others overcome. My attitude is, “If I can do it, you can do it, too.” Being a “help” is my main purpose in this life, and I really didn’t know this until I was guided through my time of change, growth and becoming by the Lord.
I had helped people all along the way, but my perception of this was different before I came through the process of transitioning from what I was, to what I became. I also gained a healthy awareness of who I was vs who I became, and the difference was truly astounding. I would not return back to the person I was before I went through the process to change, grow and become what God intended me to be.
Because of what I came through, I became a true success in every sense of the word, and it wasn’t because of the things here on this earth.
You have many who think financial success, acquiring what I call “junk” that serves no real purpose, except for “show” is true success–but that’s only a perceived success–but honestly, that house of cards can fall down in a New York minute, as true success isn’t material, and it isn’t something that can be easily lost, once gained-it’s more spiritual in nature, and the successful person who completely navigates this transitional process, learns this aspect.
It’s not how much money you make, how much stuff you acquire–all that’s material things that you cannot take with you–we came into this world naked, and we will leave it naked. Success isn’t defined by what you do, it’s defined by who you are, who you become, and the people you take the time to emotionally connect with. We were put here to serve others in whatever way we do it best, using the talents we were given. If a person is remembered for the LOVE they showed on a consistent basis–now THAT is a great example of a successful person. 🙂
I hope this helps. 🙂
((hugs))
HB: There is no doubt that you, having traveled this journey yourself, have more good sense,
practical insight, keen awareness and valuable advice than any other resource I have found.
Add to that a genuine measure of loving kindness and respect that you show each visitor to
your site and I am in awe of your gracious gift of healing grace – thanks be to God and to you!
I got so much out of your last message and so appreciate your thoughtfulness. I have exited
the rollercoaster ride, left the amusement park and have been busy making my way through life while about my Father’s business. MLC husband remains back at the park still riding the rollercoaster and uncertain about his future. I remain standing, distant, loving and prayerful as God leads us to resolution in time.
May I ask this question based on your own experience (even though each case is individual)?
We know our spouse’s inherent, core, stable identity and personality beneath the many layers
of emotional distress presently being experienced. A baseline/standard of-sorts – known from
years of close relationship. If and when a MLC spouse should choose to return to a LBS with intent to rebuild the relationship, is the MLC spouse markedly different in recognizable ways?
Is the identity and personality shifted far from center? Has the emotional growth, maturation,
better understanding of self, reconciliation of issues, and experiences while in MLC led them
to a completely different perspective on their wants, needs, interests, likes, dislikes, values,
spirituality, etc.? Do they emerge with a stronger sense of self with clarity of darkness vs.
light, arrogance vs., humility, joy vs. hate, acceptance vs. conflict, etc.? Are they still focused on both personal goals, dreams and aspirations as well as unity of relationships, family, and quality
interpersonal relations? Or……are they coming out of a fog into relative maturity of that of an adolescent who has yet to develop experience into relational maturity?
I know this is asking a lot. I’m just unclear how this complex MLC experience brings one
from a point of total dysfunction into stability, contentment and peace in 5-7 years. What do LBS’s report as the person their MLC spouse became after healing?
And….obviously if both partners undertake the necessary “growth and becoming” to establish themselves “new” during their separation, do the partners then not find themselves incompatible based on divergent paths taken? It would seem to me that the separation and
growth period would benefit both in that enmeshment would disappear allowing full individuality of both partners to become re-established. What do LBS’s report this stage
in their relationship to be like?
Thank you again for all you do to help others who are in this place in life. We all aim to love
with a full heart, show God’s grace and kindness, be the helpmate we are designed to, and
to grow higher in our faith and understanding of God’s plan and purpose for our lives.
Hello Merciful,
I’m sorry I took so long to answer. I seem to be running around like a chicken with my head cut off most days. 🙂
You’ll find your answer here:
The Main Purpose of the Journey to Wholeness of Healing
((Hugs))
HB: I owe you a debt of gratitude. You have been a big blessing to me. I hope one day I can pay it forward in kindness, patience, love and understanding to another whose life may intersect with MLC. Thank-you so much. At this point I really feel a need to back away, let loose, unwind and let this entanglement resolve in the way of God’s plan and purpose. It is too overwhelming to bear the responsibility of my own and family responsibilities while focusing on the twists and turns of my MLC spouse while in crisis. With your information,
education, insight and recommendations, I see that there is little I can do beyond standing for what is right and true while allowing him to learn life’s
lessons independent of me. What I need to do is rediscover balance, stability,
equilibrium and peace that I miss since all this began years ago. So…I’m willing to Let Go and Let God. I have full faith that the outcome will be just as
our Father promises…His will, not mine will be done. Meanwhile, I’ll continue
learning from your website and praying for your prosperity as well as for the
many visitors who share their stories here. With every good wish to you HB!
Dear Merciful,
You are most welcome, and your plans are right on the money. Take care of yourself, your family, your responsibilities, and leave that man to twist in the wind–he’ll figure it out, or he won’t.
If you should need anything else in the future, you know where to find me. 🙂 🙂 🙂
((BIG HUGS!!))
Hi HB;
I wanted to update you on the recent activity with MLC spouse since removing his comfort zone known
as cycling back and forth between me, our family home, and back to the abyss of secrecy, silence and unknown life some distance away. Spouse would come home for days to soak-up the acceptance,
enjoyment, hospitality, children and love we give only to bolt again after a few days. His last visit, which began with a late night arrival, a cold distant greeting, claims of physical ailments, and apparent depressive symptoms along with an immediate retreat to sleep showed no respect or consideration at all for others. Plus, my intuition is strong that he’s still in active Replay, even while he claims not to be involved with another woman. I felt it time to remove this destabilizing influence from my life after so long, so I asked him to take his things and leave with the explanation that his actions were inconsiderate, disrespectful and not welcome. He promptly left and has not been heard from since (several weeks).
This is the same avoidance and silent treatment he showed way back when he ran away after BD.
My guess is that he is using this boundary of being asked to leave our home as an excuse to empower his justification to seek solace in OW. However, I want to keep this boundary intact with no further expectations of me until he smells the Epsom salts of clarity and knows what he wants! We have a child he feebly attempts contact with, which I encourage for the child’s sake, otherwise it would be easier for me to keep the contact managed with this boundary.
So…there’s no more acceptance of his cycling or indecision and no more comfort zone here to use.
He’s gone silent and is holding out. Your thoughts on how I handled enforcing boundaries and his
response in these circumstances is appreciated. Thank you again for everything you do.
Hey Merciful!
It’s great to see you again! ((hugs))
Hi HB;
I wanted to update you on the recent activity with MLC spouse since removing his comfort zone known
as cycling back and forth between me, our family home, and back to the abyss of secrecy, silence and unknown life some distance away. Spouse would come home for days to soak-up the acceptance,
enjoyment, hospitality, children and love we give only to bolt again after a few days.
—
**As we discussed previously, he was returning long enough to establish a connection–and because he couldn’t take the pressure, he bolted again–that’s part and parcel within the crisis. However, the last time we talked he was given a choice, claimed he wasn’t seeing her anymore, but still no change in behavior. So, you took it a step further–more for the mental health of your household, because his coming and going was causing upheaval every time he came and went.
OK, so it all takes time–methinks he’s within a time of processing his affair–and with these signs showing, he may no longer be seeing her–
—
His last visit, which began with a late night arrival, a cold distant greeting, claims of physical ailments, and apparent depressive symptoms along with an immediate retreat to sleep showed no respect or consideration at all for others.
**Typical of not just the MLC, but also of the affair processing, too–there is a definite battle that goes on within the person who breaks down their affair. Being emotionally cold, distant, physical ailments because of depression…and exhaustion does lead to this seemingly rude retreat.
My question would be this: How would you consider this immediate retreat to sleep as showing no respect or consideration of others? Please forgive my direct way of speaking, but it sounds like you expected him begin acting “normal”, and he did something completely different, as per the mid-life crisis he is still languishing within.
This didn’t have anything to do with you, nor your family, and everything to do with him–and how he was feeling at that time, Merciful.
These events don’t resolve in a short time–sometimes, it takes a long time. Had you really expected he would just “snap out of it” once you made it clear he couldn’t have both you and the other woman?
It doesn’t happen like that–mid-life spouses are notorious for making a decision, then taking forever to carry it out and to finalize the end result, which includes processing their recent affair in full, after stopping ALL contact with the OW/OM. It’s nothing against you–it’s just how they are. Even when they decide to honor a boundary, it doesn’t mean they’re going to be happy about it–if they honored every boundary you set, and were happy about the same–they wouldn’t be in a major mid-life crisis, nor an emotional crisis.
—
Plus, my intuition is strong that he’s still in active Replay, even while he claims not to be involved with another woman. I felt it time to remove this destabilizing influence from my life after so long, so I asked him to take his things and leave with the explanation that his actions were inconsiderate, disrespectful and not welcome. He promptly left and has not been heard from since (several weeks).
**In active Replay does not always mean they are involved within an affair. He was in total rebellion, you set a boundary against behavior you decided you wouldn’t tolerate from him anymore, (whatever behaviors he was exhibiting at that point) that included him leaving, and he left…end of story.
Now you wait and see what will happen next….
—
This is the same avoidance and silent treatment he showed way back when he ran away after BD.
**It’s apparent that he’s cycled back into an earlier time of Replay, because there’s something he keeps missing, and hasn’t resolved it in full–so he is retrieving this in pieces. While he is doing this–he continues returning for the purpose of touching base—however, it’s like you said, he disrupts the household when he returns to stay for a time, then leaves again.
Please correct me if I’m “reading” this wrong, but I believe that your Intuition instructed you to draw this line, because he was creating a “revolving door” cycle for the purpose of continuing to avoid himself. Every time he gets close to an important aspect he needs to face for himself, he comes home, and uses his family to avoid facing himself….just like he used the other woman to do the same, but using his spouse(you)/family for this same purpose, well, it’s different, but similar in that as long as he has a distraction, he continues to avoid himself.
He is unable to deal directly with himself, so to keep that aspect of avoidance going, he comes home just long enough to drive whatever issue is haunting him away…then when he feels strong enough, he leaves again.
It would have stood to reason there would come a time when you would have had to create this next boundary anyway, so better now, than later when the cycle was possibly so ingrained, it would be much harder to break.
—
My guess is that he is using this boundary of being asked to leave our home as an excuse to empower his justification to seek solace in OW. However, I want to keep this boundary intact with no further expectations of me until he smells the Epsom salts of clarity and knows what he wants! We have a child he feebly attempts contact with, which I encourage for the child’s sake, otherwise it would be easier for me to keep the contact managed with this boundary.
**Since I’m not him, I couldn’t say for sure, Merciful if this about his seeking solace in OW—I think you’re right in that it’s more about using your boundary as an excuse to empower his justifications…however, in former times, because the emotional “draw” to return to you as that “Anchor” “Stanchion” “Lighthouse” within his MLC Storm is so strong, it’s as if he was compelled to keep returning, until you took steps the stop the cycle.
What he does with it after this last time, will be up to him. As far as balancing contact in regards to the child, this is about doing the right thing-as long as he is trying to connect with the child, you’d need to find a way to balance this aspect, and I have faith that you will continue to do just that.
As far as smelling the “Epsom Salts of Clarity”? Well, he may smell those, but that’s no guarantee he will know what he wants when he does. Even when/if he begins showing clarity, begins to make choices geared toward what he wants, because mid-life spouses have a tendency toward ‘second-guessing’ themselves, and because of being afraid they won’t make the “right” choices for themselves, it really can take them what seems to be forever to figure out what they want.
However, what he might come to want, might not be you, and you would have to not only accept that, but also learn to respect this. It’s something all of us will come face to face with during this journey–the mid-life spouse can choose an alternate path at any time, just like we can…Each person has choices, free will that God won’t tamper with, although He will work in hearts.
You might ask, “What is the point of Standing considering all this that can happen?” First of all, there IS HOPE, where there is STILL LOVE. We stand because we still have that love, still have that hope, and we still remember the people they were before their MLC–we know this isn’t “normal” behavior in the first place. Although we will later come to know and understand that when/if they come through, they won’t emerge the same person they were, they will be recognizable enough that we will still “know” them, and love them–by the time we begin reconciling with them a long way down the road, we will have learned to accept them for who they are, not for what we might think to want them to be.
However, it’s always a long road to learning lessons of this type…and it all takes time. Of course, the longer they’re fought, the longer it takes to learn, if these are learned at all.
By the time we get underway, we will have learned that we can’t control them, although we can set limits/boundaries on bad behaviors we have learned we don’t have to accept in them. No, we will not “remake” them into perfection through our own growth, but by the time they emerge, BOTH people will have changed in ways they didn’t think was possible when this crisis began.
Within this time in-between, we wait, but don’t wait. We watch, but don’t watch–we learn to do for ourselves, and let them go to learn to do for themselves. We learn to respect the fact that in spite of what they are dealing with, that they’re adults, with the right to make choices that may or may not include us in their lives.
And we learn to be OK, no matter what happens going forward. Whether they eventually return or not, will come to a point it doesn’t matter, because we will have learned to ‘save’ ourselves first…and if the journey has been walked into a time of being able to handle their brokenness upon their return, we learn to exercise what we’ve already learned on them, and through our changes, we trigger theirs, and through this process, we will continue growing.
What comes to me, is he’s trying to “punish” you by using “no contact”, because in his mid-life crisis swiss cheese entitled-thinking mind, his rebellious thoughts would be, ‘Who do you think you are to throw ME out?’ Like any mid-life spouse who shows these clear signs of Narcissism, he really thinks he’s special, when honestly, he’s not that special–he’s just a rebellious wayward spouse who happens to be having a mid-life crisis.
I don’t mean to sound snarky or mean, when I say that–their emotional pain is real–but at the same time, you can’t always allow certain behaviors to continue.
Once a boundary is set, it all takes time to sink in–give him time to figure it out.
—
So…there’s no more acceptance of his cycling or indecision and no more comfort zone here to use.
He’s gone silent and is holding out. Your thoughts on how I handled enforcing boundaries and his
response in these circumstances is appreciated. Thank you again for everything you do.
**I was thinking about you the other day, believe it or not. I knew you’d be back when you needed anything. I’m glad to know that you’re doing well, Merciful. I think you handled him fine, and I believe that your Intuition was in line with what you did–that’s a bonus on your part.
I think you came to ask these questions, because your Intuition DID instruct you in this way–and though you did what you were instructed to do, in exactly the way it said to do it, somewhere in your mind, you had a tiny little “second guess”–as what you did, within the realm of setting this necessary boundary, constituted a major change/shift in the current dynamics, and I can understand the uncertainty, because I’ve been down that road before, too.
His response in running, well, that’s on him, and time will tell how things will go. Since you can’t make him straighten out, and he has to want to do this–all you can do is exactly what you did–set the boundary, and leave the rest to his understanding.
Plus, give that man to the Lord, because He is the only one who can figure out what to do with him. Live your life forward, and let it all go.
Keep me posted on how things go.
***Additional note for people reading this answer: Remember that each situation calls for different handling, because not every mid-life situation is the same. Although you may find similarities in each situation, you would know your mid-life spouse better than anyone except God–and ultimately, only YOU, the left-behind spouse would know if given advice would work, not work, or somewhere in between.
Also, when you take steps to break a cycle, remember it all takes TIME, because you will never see the result of your cycle-breaking steps right then–most of the time, it will be later down the road before you’ll realize the impact of what you did. Doing the right thing is often hard, and sometimes we think we have wrecked a given situation, because of what we were forced to do in the breaking of a recognizable cycle. However, if you will pay strict attention to your Intuition at all times, understand that it will never tell you something that is harmful to you or your mid-life spouse…that is NOT how God works.
((hugs))
Hi HB:
Thank you for your thoughtful and helpful reply. You made many clear points related to my situation and, whereas I tend to expect reason and logic from my spouse, your comments remind me that to expect anything close at this stage is pointless. I tend to think at various crossroads that a light bulb moment will occur with my spouse; that is where patience needs to continue.
To answer your question as to why I felt let down after spouse’s late night arrival visit, cold and distant greeting, depressive appearance and retreat to sleep, it was because that visit was planned so that he could take care of a major personal responsibility here. Unable to do so, followed by these actions led me to feel gross inconsideration and negligence on his part.
Keep in mind, I make no requests or ask anything of him by way of responsibilities; however,
this one was an important matter only he could accomplish. Now I know not to expect anything unless he initiates and follows-through of his own accord.
I see your points in everything you said. It’s really about me having boundaries, standing my ground, continuing on my own journey of growth and becoming all that I am to be independent
of my spouse, and allowing God’s plan for our relationship to reveal in His time.
All of what I do in my approach and handling of this experience relies on God’s guidance, direction, Intuition, mercy and grace. I seek His wisdom continually and aim to be an agent of His Love to others. This is the attraction that my spouse has to me . As hard as it has been
to get this far, I am feeling the presence of Spirit in all I do. This offers some measure of peace,
patience with my spouse’s adversity, strength to carry-on family responsibilities which are many, fellowship with good people when I need them, and the expression of loving kindness to my spouse where possible.
How my spouse responds to boundaries are unknown at this time. I can say that you are absolutely right about “distractions” being his first choice for dealing with his pain. Most everything he does that contributes to the chaos is an impulsive distraction. In time he
will have to face the reality of his choices and find higher-ground to ascend from his low place.
Thank you so very much for your patience and understanding as you work with others in need.
You are a true blessing and so very appreciated for all you do. Blessings to you, HB
Hi Merciful, 🙂
I see your points in everything you said. It’s really about me having boundaries, standing my ground, continuing on my own journey of growth and becoming all that I am to be independent
of my spouse, and allowing God’s plan for our relationship to reveal in His time.
This is the crux of everything, as you so succinctly and eloquently put it. As long as God directly guides your steps–and I have sensed Him with you from the beginning– you will never “step” wrong Merciful, for God will order our steps according to His Will, as we continue to submit our will unto His. 🙂
Keep me posted on how you are.
((hugs))
Hello HB:
Looks like you’ve been deluged with new visitors in need of help! The new forum addition should be a big help to you and channel our many questions and comments for easier management. I still don’t know how you keep up with it! I am very thankful for the gift of wisdom and resources you share.
I’ve had to fully detach, initiate no contact and step completely aside from him now . After his repeat denials that he was seeing OW, it is conclusive that he has always been seeing OW, all while wanting regular visits home to spend time with me, our family and to feel stable in a comfort zone. Because no contact gives me peace from his dysfunction to live my life without chaos, and removes me as his distraction from facing his issues, all the while reinforcing no acceptance of infidelity and lack of character, conscience and courage, I am finally comfortable with having cut the kite strings to let him blow in the wind.
In a quick and about-face turnaround, MLC spouse told me he sees the error of his ways, understands why he can’t be happy in his present circumstances, wants to return home and rebuild our marriage, BUT that he needs to end his OW relationship first! Obviously we both know this is mandatory, hence my no contact choice.
So…I did not respond to his quick-change response, preferring to maintain no contact and intend to unless/until he presents his burden of proof that OW is over/finished/gone/history. I’m comfortable leaving the ball in his court now
without any interference from me whatsoever. I also recognize that this may be the catalyst for either his awakening or our marital demise. Either way, my own growth and progress throughout this journey has led me to a conviction that our relationship can only survive on a foundation of character, conscience, courage, morality and virtues of a higher nature that express committed abiding love.
I’ve taken the ultimate risk and am prepared to accept the Lord’s will in this.
Years of being a Stanchion, guiding light and compassionate helpmate are not in vain, but now my MLC spouse is challenged to ascend from his lower nature into a fresh place of integrity and maturity toward peace and wholeness in our
relationship. I know I stood/stand for good and right all along and that I have never lost commitment or loyalty to my spouse or our marriage.
Only time will tell. I am at peace with no-contact as it affords the only reprieve.
Your thoughts as you consider this are always gratefully appreciated. Thank-you HB for all you do. Merciful
Hi Merciful, 🙂
Always good to see you again–although not under these continuing circumstances. ((hugs))
Hello HB:
Looks like you’ve been deluged with new visitors in need of help! The new forum addition should be a big help to you and channel our many questions and comments for easier management.
**You would be right, the new forum addition would help–at least help me to keep track better than what can on this site, considering the setup isn’t a very good one.
However, I hope to have the forum site up and running later in the month, if not the middle of next month.
—-
I still don’t know how you keep up with it! I am very thankful for the gift of wisdom and resources you share.
**LOL, it is not easy, but I do my best…it’s seriously hard when there are only so many hours in the day, and I also have a life to keep track of, too. However, it all works together as it was meant to.
—–
I’ve had to fully detach, initiate no contact and step completely aside from him now . After his repeat denials that he was seeing OW, it is conclusive that he has always been seeing OW, all while wanting regular visits home to spend time with me, our family and to feel stable in a comfort zone. Because no contact gives me peace from his dysfunction to live my life without chaos, and removes me as his distraction from facing his issues, all the while reinforcing no acceptance of infidelity and lack of character, conscience and courage, I am finally comfortable with having cut the kite strings to let him blow in the wind.
**You knew and I also knew that before you gave him an ultimatum, and went No Contact, he was trying to have the best of both worlds, and since he was continuing to chase you, as well as chase her, too…something in your situation had to give way–and this led to what you had to do in order to have some measure of peace for yourself.
Plus, No Contact is also designed to help you begin re-balancing yourself within this world of chaos your mid-life spouse has created that drew you into it for a while. I completely understand where you are coming from.
You tried everything else and it didn’t work, so you went down a different road.
—–
In a quick and about-face turnaround, MLC spouse told me he sees the error of his ways, understands why he can’t be happy in his present circumstances, wants to return home and rebuild our marriage, BUT that he needs to end his OW relationship first! Obviously we both know this is mandatory, hence my no contact choice.
**He can talk all he wants, but it will be his ACTIONS that will tell the tale as it stands. As you already know, even if/when he ends his OW relationship, AND goes through the processing of his affair, rebuilding his part of marriage still won’t happen, because he has a lot more growing up to do, that includes a lot of learning on his part about how to be a friend first–then it leads into other parts of growing into learn how to build and maintain a relationship, plus all of the balances involved within the same.
He also would have to learn to give some, and not always take all, if that makes sense. Much to learn for him, and he has a long way to go, before this happens.
If he tries to do this any other way than he is supposed to, he would be trying to put the cart before the horse, and he would fail in his efforts to “short-cut” what is still a long emotional growth process for and within himself.
He also has to learn that happiness is NOT provided by anyone on the outside, but is found within himself.
Much for him to learn. Mid-life spouses are often of the mindset that things are supposed to happen right NOW–and of course, that is an entitled state of mind. “I want it, therefore I should have it, I deserve it, and I will get it—NOW!”
Uh, no, NOT so fast–there are many things that would need to come to pass before certain things are attained, received, grown into.
It all takes time, and sometimes lots of it.
—–
So…I did not respond to his quick-change response, preferring to maintain no contact and intend to unless/until he presents his burden of proof that OW is over/finished/gone/history. I’m comfortable leaving the ball in his court now
without any interference from me whatsoever. I also recognize that this may be the catalyst for either his awakening or our marital demise. Either way, my own growth and progress throughout this journey has led me to a conviction that our relationship can only survive on a foundation of character, conscience, courage, morality and virtues of a higher nature that express committed abiding love.
**He has had many chances to do what was right, and he didn’t–so, now, he must also be shown to wait–through your action of No Contact. He knows what he should do, and if he doesn’t do it, he could lose everything…and I suspect that within his heart of hearts, he knows this, but at the same time, his rebellion dictates that maybe you didn’t mean what you said.
So, he will most likely test this, if he hasn’t done it already.
Yes, you would be right, he will either awaken to himself, begin to see that he must needs to do what is right and correct within this situation, i.e. get rid of that woman completely, go through his affair processing (and he could choose to want to return while still within this phase), or choose to keep her, and in that process lose you.
Either way, you’ll be just fine no matter what happens, and him, well, he would be the loser, not you.
Your ongoing journey has taught you well, and I suspect you’re also aware that should he return, and he will return broken, you will be charged with walking a much harder road of gradually teaching him how to treat you, plus help trigger his ongoing growth into an emotionally mature adult–and this will take time to accomplish.
I also suspect that you’ve been studying out a certain crossroad in regard to this aspect, as it truly is up to you. Since your marriage was put asunder by his adultery, you’re being given a clear choice between trying to navigate your marriage into safer waters, or cutting your ties completely and walking away.
I can’t advise you one way or the other in this particular aspect, simply because it is not my life, nor my choice. Although I am pro-marriage, and I will encourage people to stand for their marriages, I also recognize the fact that people must be let go to decide for themselves.
Since I teach more than just the mid-life crisis, I am also more than prepared to help people navigate their personal journeys if they should need my help. So my support, guidance, etc. does extend beyond the marital aspect into divorce, if that becomes necessary.
Although I remained married, it wasn’t my marital status that showed me as a success, it was my successful navigation through my Journey to Wholeness and Healing. We do find that in time, we stop standing for our mid-life spouses, and begin standing for ourselves.
If the marriage comes through intact, and goes into a time of renewal, rebuilding and reconciliation, then it becomes a bonus in our lives. We cannot make people do what’s right by us, and though we may choose to continue to keep hope alive in our hearts, if the mid-life spouse chooses to move on without doing the inner work necessary for themselves, walking away from us in that same process, all we can is learn to move forward for ourselves, and learn to be at peace with what we truly cannot control.
I think that many people’s biggest problem is they put too much stock and emphasis in their marital status, when honestly, human relationships as a whole are only a bonus, an addition to the life we must learn to live for ourselves.
Ultimately, it comes down to US, our choices, our lives, and as we grow, we will change, and relearn who we are in a whole new way–and this could also result in not wanting to continue our lives with the mid-life spouse, should they choose to want to return. Life is full of choices, and we do have just as many choices as the mid-life spouse who is running amok within their self-contrived field of dreams, that is always subject to transform into a pit of nightmares at any time.
It’s always something to think about, because we do start out wanting to save our marriages, but in time, we realize that we must learn to save ourselves FIRST. If we don’t, we are liable to get lost in a maze where all we will see is one dead-end after another, as we’re chasing after something we would hope to receive, but may not get what we’re after–and that would be seeing our spouse not only return, but also becoming whole and healed within themselves. We don’t have any control over that aspect, so we must needs to learn to focus on ourselves.
—–
I’ve taken the ultimate risk and am prepared to accept the Lord’s will in this.
Years of being a Stanchion, guiding light and compassionate helpmate are not in vain, but now my MLC spouse is challenged to ascend from his lower nature into a fresh place of integrity and maturity toward peace and wholeness in our
relationship. I know I stood/stand for good and right all along and that I have never lost commitment or loyalty to my spouse or our marriage.
**Well, you know because you serve the Lord, it will be His Will, and not ours that will be done, so we learn to submit, and align our will with His, and then learn to see what He would have us to do, or not do, as the case may be.
None of the time one spends within this time of trial that leads to change, growth and becoming is ever wasted–in fact, it’s all well-spent if one chooses to continue to focus on Self, and let the mid-life spouse go to do what they think they want to do, when they want to do it.
Merciful, your Stand has not gone unnoticed by God, as He has continued to guide you forward, firmly keeping you within His Hands, and you have been blessed beyond measure for your willingness to continue what often seems a path that to other people would lead to nowhere–however that is never true, when we choose to trust God with our lives–and you have continued to do that.
God never forgets the left-behind spouse–I know this to be true, because there were times the blessings I received were so great they overflowed the cup I held. Like you, I held my ground in honor, truth, justice, for myself–and I remained faithful, conscientious, steadfast. This same foundation upon which I stood, (and still stand to this day) was undergirded, and strengthened by the Lord Himself, who stayed with me, walked with me, supported me, loved me, and blessed me.
—–
Only time will tell. I am at peace with no-contact as it affords the only reprieve.
Only time, and the mid-life spouse’s willingness, or unwillingness to do what he knows is required of him in the future. His choices will help you determine what you will choose to do within the realm of your own future. You’re doing just fine, hold the line, and as you do, keep looking to Him for everything you need as you continue forward in your journey, Merciful.
Your thoughts as you consider this are always gratefully appreciated. Thank-you HB for all you do. Merciful
**The above were my thoughts, for what they were worth. It is apparent as always, you are being led directly by God, and I don’t detect any uncertainty in you–in fact, there is a lot of confidence that comes out of your words, but not all of this confidence is yours–God continues to supply you with the confidence that is also found in Him.
You really are doing so well. 🙂 In spite of all you’re continuing to face, the blessings of the Lord do continue to flow directly in your life. 🙂
Keep me posted.
((hugs))